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		<title><![CDATA[Vapers Network - Utah Support]]></title>
		<link>http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/</link>
		<description><![CDATA[Vapers Network - http://vapersnetwork.org/forum]]></description>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Sep 2010 16:30:51 +0100</pubDate>
		<generator>MyBB</generator>
		<item>
			<title><![CDATA[Utah Petition]]></title>
			<link>http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=193</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 11 Feb 2010 19:57:28 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=193</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[Here is a suggested petition, please add amendments and suggestions.<br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>We the undersigned petition the Governor to: 'ensure that nicotine and nicotine delivery products are regulated appropriately and kept available for consumers on the open market.'<br />
<br />
<br />
Non-tobacco, non-medical nicotine products offer a genuine alternative for smokers which can satisfy the desire for nicotine without the smoking habit and the enormous known harms.<br />
<br />
Life saving products such as electronic cigarettes have been widely available for over three years and have zero known serious harmful effects, they are considered by respected harm reduction experts to be at least 99% safer than smoking.  Although it is proposed to exempt ecigs from the Utah ban, other smoking alternatives will not be available, will not be allowed a chance to become popular and will not be allowed to reduce the harm of smoking.<br />
<br />
Inappropriate regulation of the nicotine market will harm people by discouraging innovation, competition, quality improvements, the creation of effective smoke alternatives and popular acceptance of smoke alternatives.  Problems will also be created by encouraging an unregulated black market or forcing people to continue smoking.<br />
<br />
Proposals to monopolise the nicotine market will not improve public health and will only serve to allow regulatory enforcers to avoid looking after consumers.<br />
<br />
Thoughtful legislation that would protect young people from toxins and addiction is clearly desirable and it would be responsible to allow availability of such products only to young people who would otherwise smoke.<br />
<br />
Making a legal action illegal because of moral judgements, misinformation or confusion with something perceived to be undesirable is unjustifiable.  There is as much justification in closing the nicotine market as there is for closing the caffeine market.<br />
<br />
Adult citizens can make their own informed decisions in choosing what they enjoy to do.</blockquote>
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[Here is a suggested petition, please add amendments and suggestions.<br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>We the undersigned petition the Governor to: 'ensure that nicotine and nicotine delivery products are regulated appropriately and kept available for consumers on the open market.'<br />
<br />
<br />
Non-tobacco, non-medical nicotine products offer a genuine alternative for smokers which can satisfy the desire for nicotine without the smoking habit and the enormous known harms.<br />
<br />
Life saving products such as electronic cigarettes have been widely available for over three years and have zero known serious harmful effects, they are considered by respected harm reduction experts to be at least 99% safer than smoking.  Although it is proposed to exempt ecigs from the Utah ban, other smoking alternatives will not be available, will not be allowed a chance to become popular and will not be allowed to reduce the harm of smoking.<br />
<br />
Inappropriate regulation of the nicotine market will harm people by discouraging innovation, competition, quality improvements, the creation of effective smoke alternatives and popular acceptance of smoke alternatives.  Problems will also be created by encouraging an unregulated black market or forcing people to continue smoking.<br />
<br />
Proposals to monopolise the nicotine market will not improve public health and will only serve to allow regulatory enforcers to avoid looking after consumers.<br />
<br />
Thoughtful legislation that would protect young people from toxins and addiction is clearly desirable and it would be responsible to allow availability of such products only to young people who would otherwise smoke.<br />
<br />
Making a legal action illegal because of moral judgements, misinformation or confusion with something perceived to be undesirable is unjustifiable.  There is as much justification in closing the nicotine market as there is for closing the caffeine market.<br />
<br />
Adult citizens can make their own informed decisions in choosing what they enjoy to do.</blockquote>
]]></content:encoded>
		</item>
		<item>
			<title><![CDATA[What can we do?]]></title>
			<link>http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=192</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 11 Feb 2010 17:40:23 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=192</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[Write to the House, Senate and <a href="http://governor.utah.gov/goca/form_comment.html" target="_blank">the governor</a><br />
<br />
Respond to media articles.  Write your own article.<br />
<br />
Make a video asking for support to keep nicotine on the market.<br />
<br />
Highlight how wrong it is to close the nicotine market whenever you get a chance.  <br />
<br />
<br />
Here are some of the benefits of keeping nicotine commercially available:<br />
<br />
improved public health<br />
improved economy and local employment<br />
better quality products<br />
competition<br />
improved product effectiveness<br />
incentive to innovate<br />
choice<br />
attractiveness of product<br />
convenience<br />
lower prices for consumers<br />
<br />
<br />
What about a petition, is there any interest in writing one?  I can draft something but don't know enough about US culture to know if it would hit the mark.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[Write to the House, Senate and <a href="http://governor.utah.gov/goca/form_comment.html" target="_blank">the governor</a><br />
<br />
Respond to media articles.  Write your own article.<br />
<br />
Make a video asking for support to keep nicotine on the market.<br />
<br />
Highlight how wrong it is to close the nicotine market whenever you get a chance.  <br />
<br />
<br />
Here are some of the benefits of keeping nicotine commercially available:<br />
<br />
improved public health<br />
improved economy and local employment<br />
better quality products<br />
competition<br />
improved product effectiveness<br />
incentive to innovate<br />
choice<br />
attractiveness of product<br />
convenience<br />
lower prices for consumers<br />
<br />
<br />
What about a petition, is there any interest in writing one?  I can draft something but don't know enough about US culture to know if it would hit the mark.]]></content:encoded>
		</item>
		<item>
			<title><![CDATA[The proposed legislation]]></title>
			<link>http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=191</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 11 Feb 2010 17:12:54 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=191</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[This is as much as I know at the moment about the legal position.  There have been amendments and concessions but it still appears to be a plan to close the nicotine market and hand it to tobacco and pharm companies.<br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Tom09;190472 Wrote:</cite>There are two bills under consideration in Utah:<br />
1st is bill HB88 „Electronic Cigarettes Restrictions“ (Ronda Rudd Menlove)<br />
2nd but more important is bill HB71 „Nicotine Product Restrictions“ (Paul Ray)<br />
<br />
Here are the sites for tracking bills HB88 and HB71, respectively:<br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0088.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0088.htm</a><br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0071.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0071.htm</a><br />
<br />
HB88 would outlaw e-cig sales to minors. No problem. It would also require direct, face-to-face sale of e-cigarettes. Highly critical, however, is HB71:<br />
Bill HB71 (as introduced) would ban the sale of e-cigs (and flavored smokeless tobacco products).<br />
<br />
Both bills have been discussed in the House Health and Human Services Committee (1/29).<br />
If interested, you can listen to the recording of the Committee hearing here (the audio starts with HB88 and goes on to HB71).<br />
It turns out that HB71 would ban e-cigarettes (and flavored smokeless tobacco) „by accident“!<br />
<br />
It’s presently left to the Committee if they remove the prohibition of e-cigarettes (and flavored moist snuff) or if they move along with it. This question is still open! Bill HB71 is on hold and will be back with amendments in Committee on Tuesday, 2 February 2010, 8:00 AM.</blockquote>
<br />
<a href="http://www.vapersforum.com/showthread.php?p=190472#post190472" target="_blank">http://www.vapersforum.com/showthread.ph...post190472</a><br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>FYI, we plan to amend this bill to exclude the ban on electronic cigarettes when it comes up for a vote this week. A number of us on the HHS committee have discussed this and the sponsor seems to be on board with that idea.<br />
I hope this helps.<br />
Rep. Evan Vickers</blockquote>
<br />
<br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/HB0071S03.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/HB0071S03.htm</a><br />
<br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/pamend/hb0071s03.hfap.01.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/pamend/hb0071s03.hfap.01.htm</a><br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>76-10-3003. Provision of nicotine product prohibited<br />
[...&#93;<br />
(3) (a) As used in this section, "electronic cigarette" means any device, other than a cigarette or cigar, intended to deliver vapor containing nicotine into a person's respiratory system.<br />
(b) A person is not guilty of an offense under this section if the nicotine product is produced to be, and intended to be, used only to produce vapor in an electronic cigarette.</blockquote>
<br />
<br />
<br />
340-349 are the relevant ones for ecigs here:  <a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/bills/hbillamd/hb0071s03.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/bills/hbillamd/hb0071s03.htm</a>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[This is as much as I know at the moment about the legal position.  There have been amendments and concessions but it still appears to be a plan to close the nicotine market and hand it to tobacco and pharm companies.<br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Tom09;190472 Wrote:</cite>There are two bills under consideration in Utah:<br />
1st is bill HB88 „Electronic Cigarettes Restrictions“ (Ronda Rudd Menlove)<br />
2nd but more important is bill HB71 „Nicotine Product Restrictions“ (Paul Ray)<br />
<br />
Here are the sites for tracking bills HB88 and HB71, respectively:<br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0088.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0088.htm</a><br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0071.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/hb0071.htm</a><br />
<br />
HB88 would outlaw e-cig sales to minors. No problem. It would also require direct, face-to-face sale of e-cigarettes. Highly critical, however, is HB71:<br />
Bill HB71 (as introduced) would ban the sale of e-cigs (and flavored smokeless tobacco products).<br />
<br />
Both bills have been discussed in the House Health and Human Services Committee (1/29).<br />
If interested, you can listen to the recording of the Committee hearing here (the audio starts with HB88 and goes on to HB71).<br />
It turns out that HB71 would ban e-cigarettes (and flavored smokeless tobacco) „by accident“!<br />
<br />
It’s presently left to the Committee if they remove the prohibition of e-cigarettes (and flavored moist snuff) or if they move along with it. This question is still open! Bill HB71 is on hold and will be back with amendments in Committee on Tuesday, 2 February 2010, 8:00 AM.</blockquote>
<br />
<a href="http://www.vapersforum.com/showthread.php?p=190472#post190472" target="_blank">http://www.vapersforum.com/showthread.ph...post190472</a><br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>FYI, we plan to amend this bill to exclude the ban on electronic cigarettes when it comes up for a vote this week. A number of us on the HHS committee have discussed this and the sponsor seems to be on board with that idea.<br />
I hope this helps.<br />
Rep. Evan Vickers</blockquote>
<br />
<br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/HB0071S03.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/htmdoc/hbillhtm/HB0071S03.htm</a><br />
<br />
<a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/pamend/hb0071s03.hfap.01.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/pamend/hb0071s03.hfap.01.htm</a><br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>76-10-3003. Provision of nicotine product prohibited<br />
[...]<br />
(3) (a) As used in this section, "electronic cigarette" means any device, other than a cigarette or cigar, intended to deliver vapor containing nicotine into a person's respiratory system.<br />
(b) A person is not guilty of an offense under this section if the nicotine product is produced to be, and intended to be, used only to produce vapor in an electronic cigarette.</blockquote>
<br />
<br />
<br />
340-349 are the relevant ones for ecigs here:  <a href="http://le.utah.gov/~2010/bills/hbillamd/hb0071s03.htm" target="_blank">http://le.utah.gov/~2010/bills/hbillamd/hb0071s03.htm</a>]]></content:encoded>
		</item>
		<item>
			<title><![CDATA[Proposal to Ban Electronic Cigarette Sales to Adults in Utah: A Deadly Mistake]]></title>
			<link>http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=184</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 07 Feb 2010 15:30:53 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vapersnetwork.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=184</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[<span style="font-size: large;"><span style="font-weight: bold;">Rep. Paul Ray’s Proposal to Ban Electronic Cigarette Sales to Adults in Utah: A Deadly Mistake</span></span><br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>A bill proposing a statewide ban of electronic cigarettes in the state of Utah recently passed the Health and Human Services Committee and now moves to the House for a vote, but according to experts, statements by the bill’s sponsor, Rep. Paul Ray, demonstrate a profound misunderstanding of the science behind electronic cigarettes and of nicotine’s effects on the body.<br />
<br />
“Obviously you're getting rid of some of the smoke,” Ray said during the committee meeting, but electronic cigarettes heat a liquid nicotine solution only to the point of vaporization and actually produce no smoke at all.<br />
<br />
The legislator continued, “But the nicotine is the key ingredient that's the main killer. We still know, for a fact--not maybe--we know for a fact that nicotine causes heart disease. It causes issues with the arteries. It causes hypertension.” However, researchers at the University of Alberta, say this isn't true: “The effects of nicotine itself are similar to that other popular drug, caffeine ... and the research shows that the risk for cardiovascular disease is minimal. The confusion about nicotine comes from anti-smoking activists talking about nicotine and smoking as if they were the same. While it is true that people smoke mostly because of nicotine; nicotine users die mostly because of the smoke.” (tobaccoharmreduction.org)<br />
<br />
Spike Babaian, president of the National Vapers Club, a consumer advocacy group for former smokers who have switched to electronic cigarettes, said, “If Representative Ray truly believes nicotine kills, why isn't he calling for other products containing comparable levels of nicotine--such as the gum and the lozenges-- which are much more appealing to children, to be banned as well?”<br />
<br />
The American Heart Association states on its website that nicotine products "contain none of the carcinogens or toxic gases found in cigarette smoke.”<br />
<br />
"Electronic cigarettes are marketed toward adult smokers who can't or won't quit," said Babaian. "For them, it comes down to a choice between deadly tobacco cigarettes that contain about 4,000 ingredients, and electronic cigarettes, which contain about 20. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see which is the better choice. Passage of this bill takes away a viable alternative to smoking for responsible adults, and it leaves smokers who have already successfully switched to electronic cigarettes in an impossible situation. It's inhumane, and it certainly isn't in the interest of public health."<br />
<br />
Writing specifically about the bill, Dr. Michael Siegel, professor at Boston University School of Public Health and an anti-smoking activist with more than 20 years of experience in tobacco control, responds: “What Utah is basically saying is: ‘We don't mind if you smoke, as long as you smoke the most deadly products available.’” Dr. Siegel also states, "I honestly never dreamed of seeing this day. An absolutely shocking turn of events in tobacco control. We are now promoting disease and death and trying to inhibit people - or to outright prevent them - from taking action to protect their health and possibly save their lives." (tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com)<br />
<br />
The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-Free Alternatives Association also strongly opposes any ban on the sale of electronic cigarettes to adults, according to it's Legal Director, Yolanda Villa. (<a href="http://www.casaa.org/" target="_blank">http://www.casaa.org/</a>" target="_blank"&gt;http://www.casaa.org/)<br />
However, CASAA, together with the National Vaper's Club, supports HB0088, a bill sponsored by Rep. Ronda Menlove, which would prohibit sales of electronic cigarettes to minors while allowing many responsible adults to continue using a product that prevents them from returning to smoking tobacco cigarettes.</blockquote>
<br />
<a href="http://www.onlineprnews.com/news/20647-1265536557-rep-paul-rays-proposal-to-ban-electronic-cigarette-sales-to-adults-in-utah-a-deadly-mistake.html" target="_blank">http://www.onlineprnews.com/news/20647-1...stake.html</a>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<span style="font-size: large;"><span style="font-weight: bold;">Rep. Paul Ray’s Proposal to Ban Electronic Cigarette Sales to Adults in Utah: A Deadly Mistake</span></span><br />
<br />
<br />
<blockquote><cite>Quote:</cite>A bill proposing a statewide ban of electronic cigarettes in the state of Utah recently passed the Health and Human Services Committee and now moves to the House for a vote, but according to experts, statements by the bill’s sponsor, Rep. Paul Ray, demonstrate a profound misunderstanding of the science behind electronic cigarettes and of nicotine’s effects on the body.<br />
<br />
“Obviously you're getting rid of some of the smoke,” Ray said during the committee meeting, but electronic cigarettes heat a liquid nicotine solution only to the point of vaporization and actually produce no smoke at all.<br />
<br />
The legislator continued, “But the nicotine is the key ingredient that's the main killer. We still know, for a fact--not maybe--we know for a fact that nicotine causes heart disease. It causes issues with the arteries. It causes hypertension.” However, researchers at the University of Alberta, say this isn't true: “The effects of nicotine itself are similar to that other popular drug, caffeine ... and the research shows that the risk for cardiovascular disease is minimal. The confusion about nicotine comes from anti-smoking activists talking about nicotine and smoking as if they were the same. While it is true that people smoke mostly because of nicotine; nicotine users die mostly because of the smoke.” (tobaccoharmreduction.org)<br />
<br />
Spike Babaian, president of the National Vapers Club, a consumer advocacy group for former smokers who have switched to electronic cigarettes, said, “If Representative Ray truly believes nicotine kills, why isn't he calling for other products containing comparable levels of nicotine--such as the gum and the lozenges-- which are much more appealing to children, to be banned as well?”<br />
<br />
The American Heart Association states on its website that nicotine products "contain none of the carcinogens or toxic gases found in cigarette smoke.”<br />
<br />
"Electronic cigarettes are marketed toward adult smokers who can't or won't quit," said Babaian. "For them, it comes down to a choice between deadly tobacco cigarettes that contain about 4,000 ingredients, and electronic cigarettes, which contain about 20. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see which is the better choice. Passage of this bill takes away a viable alternative to smoking for responsible adults, and it leaves smokers who have already successfully switched to electronic cigarettes in an impossible situation. It's inhumane, and it certainly isn't in the interest of public health."<br />
<br />
Writing specifically about the bill, Dr. Michael Siegel, professor at Boston University School of Public Health and an anti-smoking activist with more than 20 years of experience in tobacco control, responds: “What Utah is basically saying is: ‘We don't mind if you smoke, as long as you smoke the most deadly products available.’” Dr. Siegel also states, "I honestly never dreamed of seeing this day. An absolutely shocking turn of events in tobacco control. We are now promoting disease and death and trying to inhibit people - or to outright prevent them - from taking action to protect their health and possibly save their lives." (tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com)<br />
<br />
The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-Free Alternatives Association also strongly opposes any ban on the sale of electronic cigarettes to adults, according to it's Legal Director, Yolanda Villa. (<a href="http://www.casaa.org/" target="_blank">http://www.casaa.org/</a>" target="_blank"&gt;http://www.casaa.org/)<br />
However, CASAA, together with the National Vaper's Club, supports HB0088, a bill sponsored by Rep. Ronda Menlove, which would prohibit sales of electronic cigarettes to minors while allowing many responsible adults to continue using a product that prevents them from returning to smoking tobacco cigarettes.</blockquote>
<br />
<a href="http://www.onlineprnews.com/news/20647-1265536557-rep-paul-rays-proposal-to-ban-electronic-cigarette-sales-to-adults-in-utah-a-deadly-mistake.html" target="_blank">http://www.onlineprnews.com/news/20647-1...stake.html</a>]]></content:encoded>
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